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273: Leah Brown returns to the podcast this week to continue the conversation about her brother's recent passing and the impact that has had on her own faith as well as her family's.
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00:04 - Revelations of a Spiritual Awakening
14:41 - The Emotional Journey of Saying Goodbye
26:24 - A Father's Account of Andrew's Passing
32:55 - Spiritual Transformation and the Power of Prayer
41:35 - Dealing With Demonic Battles and Fear
Speaker 1:
Welcome back to Pastor Plex podcast. I am your host, pastor Plex. Support in my Chicago Bears in the offseason. It looks like it's going to be a great couple of draft picks coming up. Pretty excited about that. But with me is fellow Bears fan Leah Brown. How are you, leah?
Speaker 2:
doing well, huge Bears, yeah.
Speaker 1:
So we think we're going to draft, since I think we have the first pick and maybe right up there in the top 10 pick.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, you're asking the wrong person. It's going to be a long.
Speaker 1:
The GM over the Chicago Bears is going to have a lot of work to do in getting the right guys to compliment Justin Fields and the rest of the team. If, hopefully, it's Justin's back again, all right. Well, we're going to move on to something actually way more important, because we're in part two of a great not, I don't call it a story. It sounds like it's made up, but it's your story, so it's not made up. And so you were telling us on last episode about your brother. You're in the hospital or hospice with him hospital hospital, hospital, before he goes over to hospice. Yeah, and he kind of looks at you and we. The conversation goes a little weird and he starts saying how does it feel to be the oldest or the number one child in the Olson family? And take us to recap a little bit and take us from there.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, we had some good conversation but there was kind of this strange presence that he he was giving off and we were a little bit taken off guard. We moved the conversation to my brother, asked him are you scared to die? He said a little bit. He started talking about how he was grateful that it was my brother, michael, and I in the room. Andrew is the brother who's dying. He's grateful that it's Michael and I in the room because the other siblings have been telling him you just need to repent. If you would repent, this would all go away, this would all be better or whatever. And we said well, where are you with my brother? Michael said where are you with your faith? And so Andrew starts telling us this. He tells us that he went on and this is where we left off. He went on a seven day spiritual journey about eight years prior. That really changed the way he saw God. He said he had gained a special knowledge that precluded him from believing and the Orthodox Christianity that he was raised in. That we still, you know, confessed and he wished. Something I want to say about this is he was really kind of burdened by this, like he wished that he could still believe in Orthodox Christianity, but he said that he just could not because of this spiritual special knowledge that he had gained. So, and that's like I said, that's where we left off this, this spiritual awakening.
Speaker 1:
Okay, so talk us through this, because he told the whole story of the seven days, right? Is that where you're going to walk us through?
Speaker 2:
Yes, and he'd never told the story before. But this is I mean, this is deathbed confessional stuff, right like he's. He's dying. He has this story that we've we've heard like bits and pieces of like his life had been changing. He'd been walking away from God. He divorced, remarried, he felt ostracized from the family. He'd been seeing Eastern healers, union therapists, but we didn't know. We never heard a cohesive narrative of what had been going on, and so he shared this last thing we were expecting. I walked into the room expecting to hear some kind of mental health crisis. That's what I was looking for, right, the story of how that came on, and that is. That is not what I got. I was shooketh to the core shooketh. Okay, so he says that eight years ago he was sitting outside he was playing a video game and at the end of the game, like which. We covered a little bit of this in part one. But we'll just, we'll just do it again, if that's okay.
Speaker 1:
Yeah absolutely.
Speaker 2:
He got to the end of some level in this video game hard west, in case any of you hardcore gamers are wondering what game we're talking about and there was a chanta of demons, demons, demons. And he says that at the time he was an. He was a orthodox Christian, professing Christian, but he got really scared, which was not like him, my brother, he's like six, eight big guy. I mean tough large dude large dude, not really a fearful type, and he wanted to close the laptop top. But then there was like this voice that told him not to close the laptop and the voice told him I'm, I'm your friend, I'm not scary. And he thought it was a demon at first and it was really cold. And then the voice told him I'm not a demon, I'm your friend. Okay, and the demon told him, or the voice told him the Bible says to test the spirits, that first John one four, maybe first John four. So you should test what I'm going to say and if everything that I tell you comes true, you'll know that I'm unreliable and that I have the actual truth. Not that, not that God. And so Andrew keeps listening something like I think is just intellectual curiosity, that kind of keeps him, okay, engaging a little bit. And the voice tells him, or the spirit tells him I'm going to take you on a seven day journey and here's what's going to happen, okay. And so Andrew says, okay, I'll mend, basically. And he goes on this, this seven day spiritual awakening journey, and it's really weird. He describes it as like immense pain, feelings of immense pain, but also immense pleasure, which I thought was really odd, like something the word pleasure.
Speaker 1:
He used that word.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, he said it was otherworldly, something he'd never experienced, but they were kind of a in tandem and he, he followed the spirits guide for seven it sounds like something out of what the Dickens Christmas Carol, yeah, but he followed it for seven days and everything there were weird. There were weird things like he was walking down the street and he could control the lights, which sounds a little weird. Right, very, it's all, very weird. It's all very weird. And he ends up at a homeless camp and he finds this dirty shirt that he puts on and it fits him perfectly and he's lost. And then this homeless guy named Angel brings him back to his house where his wife is like, where have you been for the past few days? So lots of weird, like physical experiences. There was something about jumping into a dark hole where all of his siblings were outside of the hole telling him not to jump in. But he did it anyway. And then, but something to note, like what he was telling while he was telling us was the very first thing when he agreed to go on this journey. Was he immediately, when he felt that that pain, pleasure thing that happened, like right away? He said that in his mind all of a sudden, out of nowhere, he had all of these. He had a lifetime of memories from a Roman soldier from the first century who persecuted Christians.
Speaker 1:
Oh, wow.
Speaker 2:
And the guy's name was Crassus, and then he was like, why do I have this lifetime of memories in my head all of a sudden about this guy? And he was really kind of like bumped because they were really dark, as you would imagine so. And then he starts like googling this name and this person and starts seeing like that a lot all of his memories line up with historical account and so that his kind of summation of this journey, of the truth that the spirit revealed to him was that he is a reincarnated being. He's a reincarnated Crassus and a reincarnated some other two other historical figures that he mentioned but I don't think it's worth going into detail on that.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, it's, but at some point you got to go. Maybe this is me listening going. Sounds like he had a mental health fall off. He reads a random book about crasses or something like that and now is, you know, back to his own mind or whatever, goes home after being homeless for a while. I mean, it sounds like you could intellectually go demons. Maybe sounds like a mental health crisis and a history book that somewhere buried in his brain came out.
Speaker 2:
Which was what I went into their expecting and thinking Absolutely and with no more context or experience. That would be I think a takeaway. But here's why I couldn't stick with that because I'm sitting in the room. Like I said, that's my preconceived notion. That's what I'm expecting. I'm super skeptical about all the hyper spirituality. I'm definitely not there for that, but there's this pounding in my soul and there's this. I knew, like I saw the presence of something other than Andrew when I sat down in that room and he began talking to me and while he would talk to us, there was this weird kind of like he would space and his eyes would wander and then all of a sudden he would space and his face would be. He'd be talking at Michael and his eyes would be like this and he would be like I'm not gonna be able to see me the whole time and it was just like that and it was really weird and I was like, oh my gosh, I've possibly been in the presence of evil spirits before and I was like I think I was like I think I know what I'm seeing and a funny thing, I actually had chosen to fast before walking into this, just kind of like I don't know what it was. It was a weird. I felt compelled it was strange. So I had been fasting for 24 hours at this point and every time I was like this has to be, like this is demonic, this is demonic. And then my mind would be like don't be crazy, you know that's not. You know that's not what's going on here. But then I would be like God is this? Am I seeing what I'm seeing here? Am I experiencing what I'm experiencing? You can feel it with every fiber in your body. I mean, I have a Holy Spirit inside of me and the Holy Spirit's like like, but then my brain is like don't be so overdramatic. You stop it, and that's a theme throughout this entire thing. I mean, this is constant tension and for me I would be like, okay, God, like I need, I need more understanding, Like you got to show me more and then he would show me more, and you got to show me more, and he would. Every time he would answer and I would be like whoa, whoa, and then I would meet that with don't be crazy Leah. This is constant belief and doubt cycle. That's my own personal kind of inner, inner turmoil and experience during all of this. But at the end of the day. So he tells us the story. It goes on for hours and then he finishes the story and, for whatever reason I had got, I had stood up and I was close to him and I put my hands on him and I, I hugged him and a tear fell from, like, my face onto his forehead and when that happened he started sobbing, just crying, and he was like I just don't want to be those people. He was like I don't want to be these people, I don't want to be these past lives, I just want to be Andrew. I really just want to be Andrew. He's like I want to be free. And then he said, can you set me free? And I was just like sobbing and I'm like praying over him. And then the nurses come in to take him away for a drain procedure, Like after I get like two words of prayer out verbally and the rest was like in my head, you know, like I'm praying through this whole thing and they take him away and Michael and I are looking at each other and we're like like what just happened? Like what did we just hear? What did we just see, what did we just experience? And Michael and I, like I said, who hadn't had any we're very different kind of worldview at this point Like and we hadn't had any discussions about this and he's looking at me and he was like I don't know if that was Andrew and I was like there was some Andrew, but I don't think that was all Andrew, and Michael walks out of the room to go get some snacks. He's pretty, pretty overwhelmed. At that point I text all my friends Like I have a small, not all my friends, my closest friends, my community group. I text them as, like you guys, I don't have time to explain, but I need prayer, like I don't. I think something is really wrong with Andrew. I think it's spiritual. I don't know. I'm super confused, but I just need you guys to pray for like clarity and discernment and whatever. It's funny, I'd always consider myself a fairly discerning person spiritually, but then this moment you feel so. You feel it's so weird that you can feel 100% confident about something and then that doubt seeps in and just derails you.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, okay. So he leaves the room, you and Michael get a snack, and then you're waiting for him to come back. What happens next? He?
Speaker 2:
comes back, they put him in a transport to take him to hospice, which hospice is going to be at my grandmother's house, who lives in Phoenix.
Speaker 1:
Right.
Speaker 2:
Michael gets in the transport with Andrew and they ride to hospice together. I get in my dad's car. He shows up which he hadn't been there for any of that. He shows up, he takes me. We stop for euros. Speaking of Chicago, they're so good.
Speaker 1:
They are good.
Speaker 2:
Get them to bring home. And on the way, as soon as we get in the car and the doors are shut, I look at my dad and I'm like dad, remember what you said about demons, like a month or two ago? And he was like yeah, I was like so, so we know, andrew's like possessed, right? And my dad was like no, I don't know, we don't know that. And I was like but remember what you said. He's like well, I mean, I think he's like tormented, I don't know. And I was like let me tell you, have you heard any of this? And I recounted a few details of the story and he was like no, that's so weird. And then I just told him I was like my dad's, like. I just I really don't know that he's like possessed, but maybe. And I was like well, let me tell you what he said to me at the end of like he told me that for hours, this whole conversation, and then at the end of it he said I don't want to be any of those people. He was talking about the reincarnation stuff. And then he said I want to be free. I just want to be free. Can you set me free? And my dad just looked at me and he's like out of nowhere just starts tears just rolling down his face. I'm sure he wouldn't want me saying that out loud, but it's true. I think I've seen my dad cry once in my life up to this point maybe my wedding day and he looked at me and he was just like, oh wow, he's like I think we've got to set him free and I was like, whoa, it was a really quick turnaround, but then we didn't really talk about it much more.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, so so you just left it out, we gotta set him free. Then what happened?
Speaker 2:
Andrew goes home. He goes to hospice, home, home, he goes to hospice at my grandmother's house. My dad and mom are there. They'd already been staying at my grandmother's house while they were caring for him, like in the hospital. I'm there, my brother, michael's there. We're staying in a hotel, but we're spending time at the house as much time as possible. In my mind and I think, in all of our minds simultaneously although we weren't having much conversation about it, because when somebody is dying it's chaotic I mean we're doing like trying to finalize will stuff, medical power of attorney stuff, physical things. Like Andrew, he's 34, he doesn't have any of that sort of out. I mean, you know, you don't think you're gonna die at 34. So we're trying to get all of these things in order accounts. That's tricky because he's got the wife, who's kind of out of the picture because she kicked him out, but then she wants to come back in the picture. And here's the other thing about Andrew. He was really loved, he had so many friends, and so the minute that his current wife posted on her social media that he was dying, his phone was blowing up. I mean it was a constant influx of calls, texts. People were driving in from across the country to visit him, to try to see him before he died, and so what I thought was going to be a nice, peaceful couple of days watching some of our favorite childhood movies together and laughing, turned into just absolute chaos and this constant pressure of like we need to pray with him, we need to talk to him, we need to have more conversations. We've got to put some oil on him or something.
Speaker 1:
I don't know.
Speaker 2:
We can't just like sit here and let him die. Like we've got to minister to him. But it was so difficult but it did happen. God was good to provide some opportunities. There were moments, there was a lot of time, where we would all just kind of be getting ready for a meal and there would be prayers and they were very intentional prayers and then my dad would pull his guitar out and he'd start singing hymns and we'd start singing and praying over Andrew and laying hands on Andrew and praying. And there was one night where I'd felt like these prayers and songs were great, but I also felt a strong. I think I talked to you on the phone that day. Yeah, remember, I called you and I was told you I think I'm crazy, but also I'm not crazy. I know what I see. I'm looking at directly in the eye, like I can see this, I know this, but what do I freaking do and how do I find the courage to do it and how do I find the time to do it? And so there was one night where I had been texting with his ex-wife and asked her if they hadn't seen each other in five years since the divorce and she'd found out through the social media posts that he was dying. She was very upset, obviously, like no matter how hard things get, I think that you're still really shocked and upset when something like that happens. And I asked her, like would you like to see him? Like would you like to say goodbye? And she was like I don't know, I don't want to get in the way. And I was like Megan. I was like you can't regret doing it. You can only regret not doing it. I think you should come. And she says, okay, you're right, ask him if it's okay, if he wants to, if he'll see me. She says, of course, I want to see him, I love him. And so then she's you know she's crying. I was like, all right, I'll talk to him. So I talked to him and I asked him as like hey, you can say no, but I did talk to Megan and she would like to come see you if that's possible. And he said I told him was like you can have some time to think about it. And he says I don't need to think about it, I love her, I want to see her, and so we were able to. It was not easy, like scheduling a dying man's visitations can get overwhelming when your brother has a lot of friends. What I mean that's wild.
Speaker 1:
I mean just thinking about scheduling a dying man's visitation.
Speaker 2:
When you don't know how many hours he has left. It could happen anytime, and everybody wants to come say their goodbyes. So we were able to get her in and there was something in my, in my spirit, whatever, and I don't know the right language for all this stuff.
Speaker 1:
But it was like a people lined outside the house or something.
Speaker 2:
We did have to kick people away. Yes, it wasn't quite Jesus and the disciples kicking people away, but no, yeah, there were people driving up that were not told that they, that we could even get them in. They were just coming. They were just coming through and showing up and it was like, oh dear it was, it was hard you need to make this into a movie.
Speaker 1:
Go ahead.
Speaker 2:
So the writer is probably going to write a book about it. He's very gifted writer and he actually quit his full-time job to write full-time. And this is from my brother, Michael, who was there for the whole thing.
Speaker 1:
Okay, keep going. So there he is. Does he meet Megan?
Speaker 2:
So I was able to schedule a time for Megan to come. A lot of my family is a little upset about that, just because they're they're jealous for time with him. And so the constant influx is stressful and overwhelming, but I felt that this was really important. So she comes, she brings some food it's the sweetest thing and they, they smile, like they're in the room together for five hours laughing. You can hear them laughing and I'm like in my heart I'm like, oh, this is so good, I'm so happy this is happening. But also I had thought this is the same day that I spoke to you. I was talking to you on the phone while she was visiting with Andrew. I was like when she leaves, I think that he's going to be kind of in a vulnerable place, yeah, where we'll, maybe we'll be able to get him back to that part of like.
Speaker 1:
I don't want to be those people.
Speaker 2:
I want to be free, I want to be that version of Andrew. And so she's there for five hours and then I tell I kind of tell my my mom and my brother had been thinking the same thing, even though we hadn't talked about it. Now this is the weirdest part of the story, but I'm going to tell it anyway because I it speaks to my constant confidence and doubt at the same time, like I felt really strong about what God was calling us to. But I also was so doubtful in and I told my mom and dad. I was like I think no, my mom and brother. I was like I think after Megan leaves will be a really good time to start talking to him about Jesus and ask him if we can pray deliberately and pray against like any demonic spirits. And my mom was like we can't. This guy is driving in. He's been driving in from Texas, florida, and he's gonna be here at nine o'clock right when Megan leaves. Like it's not gonna work. And I looked at them and I said, which God forgive me for this. But I was like, well, I guess we're gonna pray for a car wreck then, because this has to happen. I know I'm not proud of it, but it came out of my mouth and I kid you not. Five to 10 seconds later my sister who had been outside walked in and she says so-and-so, just texted me. He says he's not gonna make it tonight because there's a car wreck and he's stuck in traffic and he won't get here. And I looked at my mom and brother. I was like boo. There's nothing like being right go ahead, I mean look, I don't think my prayer caused a car wreck. That's just a little disclaimer here.
Speaker 1:
but but it did happen. So, yeah, anyway, go on. So, like this is a movie, go on.
Speaker 2:
Yeah. So then there's like this kind of we have to convince my dad, I think my mom that doesn't matter. But my dad was hesitant. He thought Andrew was tired. I said, okay, I'm gonna go in Andrew's room, here's the deal. And if Andrew's on his phone then I'm not coming out. I'm praying over him, but if he's asleep I'll leave him alone. Well, I go in his room, he's on his phone and I don't come out. I ask him if I can pray with him. Eventually, more and more people start flooding in the room and for a couple hours we pray with him very intentionally and it's really good. And I'm not gonna say anything crazy happened, cause it didn't like there was no clear tell of anything. But it was, I think it was important and it was powerful, and I'll leave it at that, anyway, yeah, so that's what we do. The next morning we go to church not Andrew, obviously and then I flew out that afternoon?
Speaker 1:
Which church, you guys?
Speaker 2:
go to, Not any famous ones. It was a great church. I don't remember the name of it.
Speaker 1:
Sorry, phoenix, it was nice.
Speaker 2:
But my grandma actually she used to go to like a different church but she moved recently into like an older person's community and she changed churches and she'd tell me all the time you need to come visit me in Phoenix and come to church with me. It's a lot like your church. I think you'll really love it. And now I get there and I know what she meant. It is actually a lot like our church.
Speaker 1:
And so it was great. I enjoyed it.
Speaker 2:
It was really good we sang in Christ alone, which was one of my faves.
Speaker 1:
So it was nice.
Speaker 2:
But, yeah, then that afternoon I left and I went out of town and I felt I remember, I gave him a hug, I told him I was coming back that weekend so this is on a Sunday and I was gonna come back the next weekend, but I had to go home and take care of my children. I felt like I needed to. I felt a lot of peace about the decision and I was well aware that he might not make it to the next weekend, but I did feel like that was the right thing to do and I gave him a hug and I kissed him on the forehead and I'll never forget his lip, so or his forehead, was like so cold because his body temperature, I think, was like 94. And I told him I was like, if you get a little better, we're gonna go to that water park down the street and we're gonna float around. We have a special water park trauma as kids and we always said that we were gonna go to the water parks. Anyway, it's a thing. We never went to a water park as a kid. We thought we were once, but then we were disappointed and then it's always strange, strange thing, I don't know. Whatever Doesn't matter.
Speaker 1:
But All right, so tell me about this how did you like processing all that? So he passes away. Yeah, so no, no no, but you're not there for it. Did you hear anything in the process of him passing away that would like he's in heaven or you don't know or like. Where are you at with that?
Speaker 2:
Yeah, so I was calling, I was texting and checking in like every day, like I'm home Monday, tuesday, wednesday, and they said after I left on Sunday he didn't talk anymore, like so this was the next day like he had stopped talking. And that was really sad and every update was sadder and sadder and, you know, harder and harder. And then finally, like on Thursday, I'm in, I'm at Kalahari go figure, a water park.
Speaker 1:
Nice.
Speaker 2:
For a birthday party and around 4.15, I get the call that he's passed away and I mean that was. I did a water slide for him.
Speaker 1:
Nice, Aw. And so, yeah, I mean there's a lot of odd coincidences with you. Well, we're gonna get to that. Yeah, all right, go ahead, walk me through it.
Speaker 2:
Yeah. So I asked, my mom called and she's I'm at Kalahari, I'm in like the little gift shop, and she says he's passed. I was like, well, how did it happen? Tell me everything. She's like I don't have time to share all the details right now, but we feel really confident and I was like well, what does that mean? And she's like your dad will have to tell you the story. He was there and I was like, oh okay, well, that's like exciting. And so I'm calling my dad but he's not picking up because they're telling everybody that Andrew's passed. And I get it like it's fine, important news for everybody to know. But eventually it's like a day or two later I get a hold of my dad and he starts sharing how, what happened in Andrew's final hours, and so he says he said the same thing. My mom says he said I'm pretty confident. And I was like, well, give me some of that.
Speaker 1:
Like what's going on. Let's have some confidence here.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, tell me about that, he said. He told me that it was Wednesday night and he decided to. He had been like the last two nights since I left, since Andrew stopped talking, to sleep in the bed next with Andrew. So Andrew had a king bed and my dad slept in bed with him and was just kind of like keeping an eye on him, giving him his meds and also like constantly praying for him. So he says it's Wednesday night, really technically Thursday morning, and he just feel he wakes up around like 3, 4 am and he feels a strong, like press, like he needed to pray more seriously for Andrew, pray more seriously. So he starts praying for Andrew and singing some songs, hymns and praying and Andrew starts responding. Every time which remember Andrew hadn't been talking for days every time that my dad would say the name Jesus Christ, andrew would start like thrashing and screaming at the top of his lungs.
Speaker 1:
Screaming, screaming, so like middle of the night. He says Jesus Christ and your dad says Jesus Christ, and then he starts thrashing.
Speaker 2:
Mm-hmm, and it's just like two hours of like this constant, like episode, and every time, like my dad points out, like Andrew was constant, he was responding to the name of Jesus every time and he was like that was really telling to him. He wakes up my mom and brother to come in because he's getting exhausted from the thing, and he's my dad puts it. He says he felt that Andrew's spirit was in a battle pretty confidently. I mean, we don't know, but maybe we do. And so that went on for hours and hours, and hours and then finally Andrew was more peaceful and he rested and calmed down and then around 3, 30 ish, PM. PM. My mom is. My mom is reading the some scripture to him, so they had just been doing this like constantly at this point nobody's visiting, because he's called almost like Comatose, it would seem after that episode in the morning and like they had had a priest come in and pray. Priest oh. I think, they're called that with like hospice or whatever. But oh, wow some well, some kind of Priest that knew about exorcism nice. And there had been like lots of, lots of praying, lots of reading scripture. But in Andrew's final hours my mom had had a voice memo from Andrew's best friend who was a pastor, who had sent a little mini sermon on the parable of the vineyard worker and it was the like, you know, the, the workers who worked all day in the field. And then there was the workers who worked at only the final hour and at the end of the day the Vineyard owner, the master, paid them the same wage. And so the sermon was kind of like Andrew in this guy. He kept saying Andrew, there's still time for the day's wage, like it's not too late to come to Jesus right. And so but the voice memo like pooped out at the last minute. So my mom, she just picked up the Bible and tried to finish off the sermon and she, she's reading like the end of the parable and she tells him, she's like, there's still time for the day's wage, andrew, there's still time for the day's wage. And then she's like and then he just took his last breath and he, he died in that moment. Wow, at like 415. And so they, they felt really strongly. I mean, I think everybody wants to believe that they're son. Yeah, goes to heaven, right, everybody wants to believe that. But they, especially with being how skeptical my dad was, like I think God gave them a lot of kind of peace and, and I had, I had a lot of that too, actually, which I I was like why do I feel this way? Is it? Is it just hopefulness? Is it just what's the word, wishful thinking? But I feel this way, and that was that was he passed, and so we, we kind of were like Going back to my battle, like of this confidence and then this doubt. It's like the next day or after that, and I'm like I put my kids down for a nap, I'm looking for every solitary moment that I can have just to like kind of think and pray and dwell and meditate, whatever all the Things, and I'm sitting in my bed, I'm just, and I'm like it dawned on me Andrew had told me this elaborate tale about like a seven-day spiritual awakening right that started At one hour and it ended seven days later on the dot on the hour, and I started thinking. I was like, wait a minute, andrew came home to hospice on a Thursday and he died on a Thursday. And I was like that was like seven days, seven days of prayer, fasting, singing hymns, trying to cast out demons, like all the things. Like that was seven days and all of a sudden I just had this peace. I was like Like that couldn't, that's not an accident, you know it was and it wasn't like, oh, this is a sign from God. Yeah it was like God is poetic.
Speaker 1:
You know, it's like he is poetic.
Speaker 2:
He does that stuff and so. But then, to make it better, I Text I Called my dad right away because I, like I, had to tell him this realization. I had to, and he didn't pick up the phone Of course he didn't. So then I called my brother and he didn't pick up the phone. And then my dad calls me back and he says, hey, I was just thinking and I wanted to tell you something, and I was like what? And he says I just realized that Andrew came home to hospice on a Thursday and then he died on a Thursday for seven days. And he told me the same thing that I had just thought in my head and I mean I was like Wow, who has the power to put a thought in both of your heads at the exact same moment? to give you like a piece that passes Understanding. And then he said, and I just got off with the phone with Michael, your brother, and he just told me that he had the same thought and I'm like, yeah, well, me too. Like it was like all of us had had that epiphany in that moment. And so my brother later wrote he had been keeping Michael, he'd been keeping diaries of all of this and he was like there was about a two-hour difference from the moment Andrew came home to hospice to his death, because he came home around 615 and he died around 415, so it wasn't a perfect to the hour. And then it was actually only until coming here that I was thinking about that and I went and looked back at my text messages that I had sent to my community group right after Andrew went to get his drain done, and it was, it was 415, it was 420 that I texted them that Andrew had been Asking to be free and saying he wanted to be fret set for you like that kind of calling out moment I was like seven days to the hour from that moment of like Begging for rescue nice pretty cool very cool.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, that's wild.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, it is wild.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, I just and obviously I think you're going back to. It was a seven-day journey. That was his demonic guide, and then the seven-day journey to freedom. Yeah amazing, wow. So how have you probably, when you process that, like looking back and looking forward, like what does that do? Do anything Different for your spiritual life? Are you more encouraged, more I don't know peaceful, more what?
Speaker 2:
Yeah a lot. I Don't feel like I'm the same. You talk about other people all day long, but not me. That's when I start losing. Okay, so I've always been Figurously devoted to Jesus, but now I have this as Much as I wanted. Oh, my dad would always tell me as a kid he would say you better humble yourself, leah, or else God's gonna humble you. And and it always stuck with me because I knew it was true and I would pray Fervently to God to Humble me, because I want to be a good servant and I want to be like Jesus. But it's crazy that he can humble you through something like this, where he's showing you how it's. It's not actually about how weak or screwed up you are. Like I kind of already know that. You know it's about wow, look at what he could do, you know. And so that's kind of been my Relation, I mean it's just. And then you know, like the October 7th, this is a real, really weird jump. But the October 7th terrorists attacks happen and it's just. You have this. You have this feeling of overwhelm, like there is so much darkness in the world. Yeah and then you. I'm like God has so much to work on, like he's got so much to do. He's got so much darkness to push back and so much Redeeming and healing to do on this earth, but he still cared enough to Bring us on this journey, you know, and to show us his glory and his power through my brother's life and death and to his kind, his kindness in revealing the whole, like seven day, like the poetry of all of that gosh. I'm like man, he does care, he cares, you know, and I think a lot of people it's. You have all these questions when somebody dies, like why? Why, god, what are you trying to show us? And there was a part of me for a bit that I was like If this was about if my brother's Tragedy death office this I said this in my community group at one point I was like if this was about my spiritual journey, I'm gonna be so mad. That's not good enough. I was like that's not good enough. God, that's not a good enough reason for this, but but it actually it is. It's not about my spiritual journey, it's about his glory and, if anything, we at least me and everyone in my family or people who've been witness to this yeah, his glory has been made so much bigger and and just evident to us, and that is a good enough reason. Yeah in spite of all your questions, like his glory is always a good enough reason and it's it's the ultimate reason. And so I'm like good with that and I'm at peace with that, and I'm so much more confident in his power and his ability to work through Whoever he wants to. And then I don't say that is like a him working through me, like I don't have any evidence that he did anything through me. It's not like I just like I said it in part one, like he brought me along. He was like, hey, I'm gonna do something really cool, yeah, and you can come witness it if you want. And I'm so grateful that I stepped into that because, even though, like, I don't have something to say, like look at me, look what I did. Because, like I said, that's not the point of the story, I didn't do anything, it was look what God did. And so to that point to that point.
Speaker 1:
what do you tell people that of unbelieving family members, people they really love, that are Maybe possessed but they're not really sure maybe going through the feels demonic and they're not really sure if they're crazy? Like what do you tell people that are experiencing people they really care about and they're like kind of skeptical and they're like it's just a mental health crisis or it's whatever? I mean? Like what do you say?
Speaker 2:
I mean that's so tricky because everybody's Coming from such a different place. But what I would say is if you do have family members that are struggling and unbelieving, like, don't be too shy to minister to them. Don't be too shy to Like, bring them to God every single day and pray for them. I think that the power prayers it's even greater than I'm willing to still kind of see your witness. That's another way God's changed. Has this changed the way you pray?
Speaker 1:
Yes, how so Um that's a tricky question.
Speaker 2:
So before you prayed like X, now you pray like why?
Speaker 1:
before I prayed knowing that it mattered and that God would use it If it was fitting into his will.
Speaker 2:
now I pray Because I'm desperate and that's the only, that's the only tool I think you know, and it's like it's not as much about whether I'm doing it right or whether I'm putting the right caveats in about his will or not. It's about man. I'm giving this to God, like I'm surrendering to him, because he actually does have the power to change this and I know that, whether he does or doesn't, or to provide this or whatever, or to deliver us from this, or to free us from temptation, or for forgiveness, all those things like, oh yeah, it's real, it's real, I've always known it, but now it's like I'm so Surrendered to it I think okay.
Speaker 1:
so I feel like this is I mean, I feel like that we have a whole another thing to talk about here. I mean, I just feel like the ramifications, the implications of, like, just praying over your own children, of like, you know, like, like, is there any fear I know this might be a weird way to put this like, like the generational curse or something like I, yeah, I mean.
Speaker 2:
My brother's not the only one in my family, who even not just my mom or my brother, but they're not the only ones in my immediate family. Several of my siblings have told really detailed accounts of what they believe to be like demonic battles and encounters which I had never heard of these I didn't know. Somehow it's funny. One of my brothers, michael of course, pointed out huh, andrew skipped you, lydia skipped Jonathan, thomas, it was like every other one of them, every had kind of battled this, had these similar battles, and I was like, oh gosh, I hope my kids aren't like You're gonna be. I hope it's not a generational curse like I definitely have this thought a lot Theologically. How do you even start there? Though you know me, you're the past. I know I'm like sitting there going.
Speaker 1:
Here's what.
Speaker 2:
I do now.
Speaker 1:
I'm gonna start with a little bit. I'm like sitting there going here's what I do now.
Speaker 2:
Okay if I Do, if there was some kind of which my mom being adopted in her past who freaking knows? But if there was some kind of like a very real generational curse put on our family or on my mom that's traveled down, I believe that that was probably broken in in this experience with Andrew and, for all I know, that might have been why God, part of God's reasoning for all of that happening. If that's not true, if that didn't happen and I have this ethereal fear of like the demons coming for my kids which which I don't, but it has crossed my mind.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, I've definitely crossed my mind.
Speaker 2:
I'm not scared of that because I I think this is one of my big spiritual takeaways for sure. Like I, I have been kind of scared of like the potential of demons in your house. You know you wake up in the middle of the night or like sleep paralysis sure that's happened to me. Oh, for sure I've had they say that that can be like people have said, that can be like a Tactic of demonic forces or whatever, like I have kind of had that fear. There was a point in my right after I had my first daughter, my only daughter.
Speaker 1:
Hey Wow.
Speaker 2:
Right after she was born, my mom was it staying over and she told me that she saw like a demonic presence in my house and she went Around and like put oil everywhere. I know we son Waco now, which is making this a little bit less believable, but man, just don't ignore that. I was like there was a part of me that was like mom, you're crazy. But then there's a part of me like ooh, I'm a little scared. I'm not anymore like, because I know that it's not like beating hey, I know who wins in the end but really it's like gosh, it's not, it's not me right like the Theologically.
Speaker 1:
It's not like we're having a battle demons. Get to Jesus right. Jesus Chooses us and that's part of our prayer over kids. God, please choose my kid.
Speaker 2:
Yeah, and it's the Holy Spirit like. It's the Holy Spirit through me that has any power. It's not, it's not me like and and God has the power to protect, to choose, and he's not like it. There's no dualism.
Speaker 1:
I think that's one of the things that right dualism is Jesus first devil who's gonna win?
Speaker 2:
We don't know.
Speaker 1:
No, we don't we know, whenever Jesus interacts with a demon, possessed man, he's like and leave and they instantly go. It's they were in there, a terrified of Jesus, and the battle was Jesus Say flee. Whenever Jesus in Revelation comes down, he's got sword in his mouth, which just means his spoken words like a and he, everyone falls dead. That's the bad guys, and Jesus wins. So there is no dualism right at the same time, there's a real spiritual battle for us. So we're not Jesus, clearly, but we. Whenever we battle in Jesus name, he fights for us, and I think that's the part that I want to make sure everyone is sort of like keyed into, like like putting you in Jesus Is is part of it. Now, that doesn't mean you might not get.
Speaker 2:
Tormented by demonized.
Speaker 1:
Yeah, you won't got be demon possessed, because the demon can't.
Speaker 2:
Be where Holy Spirit is right.
Speaker 1:
So right, but do you think? There's a lot here that I don't know, and I don't want to pretend like I have all the answers, but what I do know is we can walk in confidence when we battle evil, not because of our own doing, because of righteousness of Christ. And that's why he ultimately does win in you.
Speaker 2:
You're absolutely right. I will tell you say that I 100% believed that going into this, but there was still, like this fear, right, yeah. But now that's where I'm on the other side. You're like, oh, there's nothing to be afraid of, right like Cuz we win. Yeah, he wins.
Speaker 1:
All right, hey, we're gonna have to wrap it up for this time. We'll bring Leah back, don't you worry. If you have any questions, comments, anything you want to wrap around Leah's head, we would love to investigate it. You can text us at 737-231-206-05. Go to pastor plec comm. Thanks for watching my house. You always have awesome.
